Legislature(2023 - 2024)BUTROVICH 205

01/19/2024 03:30 PM Senate RESOURCES

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Audio Topic
03:30:16 PM Start
03:30:16 PM Presentation: Alaska Center for Energy and Power: Railbelt Decarbonization Project Results
04:55:18 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ Presentation: Alaska Center for Energy and TELECONFERENCED
Power: Railbelt Decarbonization Project Results
by
Phylicia Cicilio, Research Assistant Professor,
Power Systems Engineering, Alaska Center for
Energy and Power (ACEP);
Jeremy VanderMeer, Research Assistant
Professor, ACEP;
Steve Colt, Research Professor, ACEP;
Derek Stenclik, Founding Partner, Telos Energy,
Inc.;
Matt Richwine, Founding Partner, Telos Energy,
Inc.
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
**Streamed live on AKL.tv**
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
              SENATE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                        January 19, 2024                                                                                        
                           3:30 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Senator Click Bishop, Co-Chair                                                                                                  
Senator Cathy Giessel, Co-Chair                                                                                                 
Senator Bill Wielechowski, Vice Chair (via teleconference)                                                                      
Senator Scott Kawasaki                                                                                                          
Senator James Kaufman                                                                                                           
Senator Forrest Dunbar                                                                                                          
Senator Matt Claman                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
PRESENTATION: ALASKA CENTER FOR ENERGY AND POWER: RAILBELT                                                                      
DECARBONIZATION PROJECT RESULTS                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
No previous action to record                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
JEREMY CASPER, Director                                                                                                         
Alaska Center for Energy and Power (ACEP)                                                                                       
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided an overview of the Railbelt                                                                      
Decarbonization Project.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
PHYLICIA CICILIO, PhD, Research Assistant Professor                                                                             
Power Systems Engineering                                                                                                       
Alaska Center for Energy and Power (ACEP)                                                                                       
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT: Outlined Railbelt Decarbonization project                                                                 
goals.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
STEVE COLT, PhD, Research Professor                                                                                             
Alaska Center for Energy and Power (ACEP)                                                                                       
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION  STATEMENT: Provided  an economic  analysis on  required                                                             
capital investment.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MATT RICHWINE, Founding Partner                                                                                                 
Telos Energy                                                                                                                    
Saratoga Springs, New York                                                                                                      
POSITION  STATEMENT: Provided  an  overview  of the  transmission                                                             
analysis conducted by engineers at Telos Energy.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
DEREK STENCLIK, Founding Partner                                                                                                
Telos Energy                                                                                                                    
Saratoga Springs, New York                                                                                                      
POSITION  STATEMENT:  Provided  an  overview  of  the  generation                                                             
analysis.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
JEREMY VANDERMEER, Research Assistant Professor                                                                                 
Alaska Center for Energy and Power (ACEP)                                                                                       
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided an outline of project results.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:30:16 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR GIESSEL  called the Senate Resources  Standing Committee                                                             
meeting to order  at 3:30 p.m. Present at the  call to order were                                                               
Senators   Claman,  Dunbar,   Kaufman,  Kawasaki,   and  Co-Chair                                                               
Giessel.   Senator   Wielechowski    joined   the   meeting   via                                                               
teleconference. Co-Chair Bishop arrived thereafter.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
^Presentation:  Alaska  Center  for Energy  and  Power:  Railbelt                                                               
Decarbonization Project Results                                                                                                 
    PRESENTATION: ALASKA CENTER FOR ENERGY AND POWER: RAILBELT                                                              
                 DECARBONIZATION PROJECT RESULTS                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:30:16 PM - update                                                                                                           
CO-CHAIR GIESSEL  announced the  consideration of  a presentation                                                               
on Railbelt Decarbonization Project  Results by the Alaska Center                                                               
for  Energy  and Power.  Telos  Energy  will review  the  current                                                               
project of a pathway toward 100 percent decarbonization by 2050.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI joined the meeting via teleconference.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:33:01 PM                                                                                                                    
JEREMY  CASPER,  Director, Alaska  Center  for  Energy and  Power                                                               
(ACEP), Fairbanks,  Alaska, provided an overview  of the Railbelt                                                               
Decarbonization Project. He  stated that when he  was first hired                                                               
at ACEP,  Co-Chair Bishop recommended  that he listen  to experts                                                               
in the organization. When ACEP  leaders, Dr. Phylicia Cicilio and                                                               
Ms. Gwen Holdmann  advised him to move forward  with the project,                                                               
he gave it the green light.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Resources were provided  by the Office of Naval  Research and the                                                               
State Capitol  fund. A large project,  it was the first  time the                                                               
organization  took  on the  Railbelt  Energy  system. Dr.  Ciclio                                                               
mentored  five undergraduate  interns for  the process,  involved                                                               
Ms. Alexis  Francisco, and invited  Telos Energy, a  top modeling                                                               
company in the country.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:34:51 PM                                                                                                                    
PHYLICIA  CICILIO, Research  Assistant  Professor, Power  Systems                                                               
Engineering,  Alaska   Center  for   Energy  and   Power  (ACEP),                                                               
Fairbanks,  Alaska,  outlined  Railbelt  Decarbonization  project                                                               
goals. She explained  that ACEP is an  applied research institute                                                               
within the University of Alaska  Fairbanks, meaning most projects                                                               
have a direct community partner.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
The goals  are to strive  toward energy solutions in  Alaska. The                                                               
aim of the Railbelt Decarbonization  project is to explore energy                                                               
solutions  in  Alaska,  reaching   toward  100  percent  Railbelt                                                               
decarbonization by 2050.  She clarified that ACEP  is focusing on                                                               
the  electric  grid rather  than  other  energy sectors  such  as                                                               
heating and transportation.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Cicilio moved  to slide 3. Efforts were made  to quantify the                                                               
economic  and  reliability  implications of  the  decarbonization                                                               
scenarios  to create  useful info  for  Alaskan stakeholders,  as                                                               
well  as build  in-state capacity  using industry-standard  tools                                                               
and analysis to develop the modeling and research.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Cicilio moved  to slide 4 and said that  in addition to ACEP,                                                               
a  large  team consisting  of  Information  Insights, the  Alaska                                                               
Microgrid  Group,  and  Telos Energy  were  involved  in  project                                                               
development.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:36:48 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  CICILIO noted  that  Telos  Energy is  a  leading expert  in                                                               
island grid  systems. Alaska is  an electrical island,  so Telos'                                                               
expertise is  directly relevant to  the energy problems  that the                                                               
state is seeking to solve.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Furthermore,  ACEP  has  a Technical  Advisory  group,  involving                                                               
engineers  and   managers  from  each  of   the  four  electrical                                                               
cooperatives across  the Railbelt, as  well as the  Alaska Energy                                                               
Authority and the Railbelt Regional  Coordination group. ACEP met                                                               
with this group  for approximately one hour every  other week for                                                               
over   two  years.   The  group's   input  contributed   to  data                                                               
development  and review,  ensuring accuracy  in the  results. She                                                               
acknowledged that funding  was from the Office  of Naval Research                                                               
in the state of Alaska.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:37:36 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. CICILIO  moved to  slide 7 and  briefly highlighted  six main                                                               
project components:                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
   • Scenario Development                                                                                                       
   • Load Forecast                                                                                                              
   • Resource Selection and Sizing                                                                                              
   • Generation Analysis                                                                                                        
   • Transmission Analysis                                                                                                      
   • Economic Analysis                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:38:27 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. CICILIO  moved to slide  9. Four scenarios were  developed in                                                               
2022 following a stakeholder:                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
   • Business as Usual                                                                                                          
   • Wind/Solar/Hydro                                                                                                           
   • Wind/Solar/Tidal                                                                                                           
   • Wind/Solar/Nuclear                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
The Business as  Usual (BAS) scenario is a reference  case as the                                                               
base  to  the three  low-carbon  scenarios,  which outline  major                                                               
generation technologies.  All scenarios  involved the  same load,                                                               
so demonstrate an "apples to apples" comparison.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:39:32 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. CICILIO moved  to slide 11 and spoke to  the chart on monthly                                                               
electricity demand  which represents  the load forecast  for 2050                                                               
compared  to 2021  data. The  data  also includes  the load  from                                                               
electrification,  primarily  due  to   heat  pump  additions  and                                                               
electric vehicles.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:40:13 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  DUNBAR  inquired  about the  study's  population  growth                                                               
projection   considering   Alaska's  declining   population.   He                                                               
questioned if  the results account  for improvements  in building                                                               
and   product   efficiencies    and   whether   project   results                                                               
overestimate the amount of energy needed.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:40:57 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  CICILIO  responded   that  the  amount  of   load  based  on                                                               
population  growth was  about 12  percent,  indicating a  minimal                                                               
increase from heat pumps and  electric vehicles. The load doubles                                                               
from 2021 to 2050.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:41:34                                                                                                                       
Co-Chair Bishop arrived.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:41:36 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR DUNBAR  asked about the  level of market  penetration for                                                               
electric vehicles assumed in the model.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:41:47 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  CICILIO said  that electric  vehicles depicted  the greatest                                                               
growth at  about 79%. This  number was benchmarked  against other                                                               
places  in the  country and  globally and  is lower  as would  be                                                               
expected in a Northern climate.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:42:15 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. CICILIO  moved to slide  12 regarding resource  selection and                                                               
sizing.  The  process  determined   project  size  among  several                                                               
Alaskan   regions  and   resource  type   (hydro,  wind,   solar,                                                               
residential solar, tidal, or nuclear).                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:42:31 PM                                                                                                                    
JEREMY  VANDERMEER, Research  Assistant Professor,  Alaska Center                                                               
for  Energy  and Power  (ACEP),  Fairbanks,  Alaska, provided  an                                                               
outline of project results. He spoke  to slide 13 and pointed out                                                               
that the  goal of resource  selection and sizing was  to identify                                                               
plausible projects  for each  of the  resources of  interest. The                                                               
method demonstrates sizing needs  for each resource scenario. The                                                               
projects  are  either  pre-existing   or  are  currently  in  the                                                               
proposal or  research stages.  New projects  were added  for wind                                                               
and solar scenarios.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:43:23 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. VANDERMEER  moved to  slide 14 and  mentioned that  a partial                                                               
optimization was to help solve sizing difficulties.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Resource sizing method                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                              
     ? What size to build each project?                                                                                       
     ? Predetermined project sizes for each scenario                                                                          
          ? Hydro, tidal, and transmission                                                                                      
     ? Size remaining projects based on cost                                                                                  
          ? Wind, solar, battery, nuclear, and fossil fuel                                                                      
          ? Iterate until converge on lowest cost portfolio                                                                     
     ? Only partial optimizations ? Not all projects were                                                                   
       sized based on cost                                                                                                    
          ? Stability costs were calculated at a later stage                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Vandermeer  said that scenarios  were predetermined  so these                                                               
are not  total optimizations  seeking the  cheapest path,  but an                                                               
attempt    to   build    illustrative   scenarios    of   various                                                               
infrastructure   projects.   Optimization  iterated   on   system                                                               
portfolios until lowest cost systems were reached.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
He provided an overview of results on slide 15.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Resource sizing results                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     ? Generation from wind and solar was cheapest                                                                            
          ? Curtailment costs limited their installed                                                                           
          capacity                                                                                                              
          ? Additional stability costs were identified in                                                                       
          the Transmission Analysis                                                                                             
     ? Firm sources of power were needed                                                                                      
          ? Hydro, nuclear, fossil fuel, and batteries                                                                          
     ? Nuclear was not competitive with LNG                                                                                   
          ? W/S/Nuclear scenario assumed no LNG imports                                                                         
          ? Hydro and tidal competitiveness was not                                                                             
          investigated                                                                                                          
     ? Cost projections are uncertain                                                                                         
          ? Especially for nuclear and tidal                                                                                    
          ? Sensitivity analyses were run                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Vandermeer said  that  a portfolio  was  generated for  each                                                               
scenario,   which  demonstrated   that   wind   and  solar   were                                                               
consistently  cheapest, with  a caveat  that these  sources could                                                               
only supply a limited amount of  load. Firm sources of power were                                                               
determined as necessary.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:47:17 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  CLAMAN  asked  for  clarification on  the  cost  of  the                                                               
nuclear scenario compared to LNG.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:47:44 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  VANDERMEER  responded  that  after  removing  the  liquefied                                                               
natural  gas (LNG)  option when  sizing scenarios  based on  cost                                                               
assumptions, nuclear  proved as a  lower cost option  compared to                                                               
other scenarios.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:48:20 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR GIESSEL  asked about  the exclusion  of hydrogen  in the                                                               
study.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:48:34 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. VANDERMEER confirmed  that hydrogen was left out  and said it                                                               
would be a good follow-up study.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:48:44 PM                                                                                                                    
DEREK   STENCLIK,  Founding   Partner,  Telos   Energy,  Saratoga                                                               
Springs,  New  York,  provided  an  overview  of  the  generation                                                               
analysis. He spoke to slide 17:                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Generation Analysis                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Simulate  grid operations  across  the Railbelt  across                                                                  
     all hours of the  year, considering changing load, wind                                                                  
     and   solar   availability,  reliability   needs,   and                                                                    
     operating constraints.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
          ? How are resources scheduled (dispatched) to                                                                         
          meet load in a least cost manner?                                                                                     
          ? How can grid operators manage variability and                                                                       
          uncertainty of wind and solar generation?                                                                             
          ? How should batteries be scheduled to charge,                                                                        
          discharge, and provide reliability reserves?                                                                          
          ? How do transmission flows change across                                                                             
         different weather conditions and load levels?                                                                          
          ? Which generators are displaced by new                                                                               
          renewables and what are are the fuel cost                                                                             
          savings?                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Stenclik said that much of the data was provided by                                                                         
Railbelt Utilities. ACEP wanted to ensure that their models                                                                     
accurately reflected grid operations.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Stenclik moved to slide 18.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Power system operations methods                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     Detailed plant and system details                                                                                        
     ? Load profiles                                                                                                            
     ? Wind and solar profiles                                                                                                  
     ? Hydro water budgets                                                                                                      
     ?   Gas,   coal,    and   oil   plant   characteristics                                                                    
     (efficiency, cycling constraints, etc.)                                                                                    
     ? Operating reserve requirements                                                                                           
     ? Transmission constraints                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Production cost simulation                                                                                               
     Least cost, security-constrained, unit commitment,                                                                         
     dispatch, and resource scheduling across all 8760                                                                          
     hours of the year                                                                                                          
     Utilizes third-party, industry recognized optimization                                                                     
     software                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Operations and Economics                                                                                                 
     ? Plant operations and starts                                                                                              
      - Stability analysis                                                                                                      
     ? Fuel consumption and cost                                                                                                
      - Economic analysis step                                                                                                  
     ? Emissions                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Stenclik  noted that a central  focal point of the  study was                                                               
for capacity building by using  global industry tools within ACEP                                                               
and the university.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:51:57 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  GIESSEL asked  Mr. Stenclik  to clarify  his role  as a                                                               
consultant to ACEP.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:52:10 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  STENCLIK  said  that Telos  Energy  provides  analytics  and                                                               
engineering  consulting services  and  grid  modeling across  the                                                               
country around renewable integration  studies. Telos Energy works                                                               
with  utilities, research  organizations  such as  ACEP, and  its                                                               
counterpart  in  Hawaii.  The Hawaii  National  Energy  Institute                                                               
involves  different  systems  than  the Alaska  Railbelt  but  is                                                               
similar to Alaska as a remote grid reliant on imported oil.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:52:57 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. STENCLIK  spoke to the  bar chart on  slide 19 and  said that                                                               
most emissions come from hydro  resources. Wind and solar are the                                                               
energy  backbone,  providing  over  50  percent  of  the  output,                                                               
proving  as the  "least regrets,"  and lowest  cost options.  The                                                               
uncertainty is with technology and costs.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:54:15 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  STENCLIK  said  there  is   concern  with  balancing  hourly                                                               
generation,  especially on  a  typical winter  day.  He moved  to                                                               
slide 20  and said there  is more  variability in wind  and solar                                                               
scenarios. The goal  is to ensure effective  management of system                                                               
operations.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:55:21 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  GIESSEL  acknowledged  a   baseload  of  gas  alongside                                                               
renewable energy scenarios.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:55:39 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. STENCLIK  relayed that  in annual  production, gas  remains a                                                               
large  component, but  grid capacity  will require  substantially                                                               
less gas. On cold winter days, gas is still a useful resource.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:56:07 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  STENCLIK moved  to  slide  21 and  said  that ACEP  screened                                                               
through   thousands   of   hours  of   operations   to   evaluate                                                               
transmission  reliability  and  stability  in  more  detail.  The                                                               
analysis  demonstrates  a  "dispatch condition"  or  the  biggest                                                               
challenges within a year of operations.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:56:29 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  GIESSEL  said slide  21  showcases  battery as  a  huge                                                               
piece.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. STENCLIK  reiterated the "lower  regrets option" of  wind and                                                               
solar energy  and emphasized  enabling technologies,  including a                                                               
transmission network and battery storage,  which is a key enabler                                                               
to reaching high penetrations and providing grid stability.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:57:20 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. STENCLIK  spoke to  the graph on  slide 23  demonstrating the                                                               
timing of resources and appearance on the grid.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
         Timing of wind and solar generation will vary                                                                        
     significantly across the year                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
        • A portfolio with 50 percent wind and solar will                                                                       
          see periods exceeding 100 percent of total load                                                                       
          (due to battery charging)                                                                                             
        • Inverter-based resources (IBRs) like wind, solar,                                                                     
          and batteries have different controls and                                                                             
          interactions with the grid                                                                                            
        • Periods of high penetration (see chart) must be                                                                       
          evaluated in further detail for transmission                                                                          
          reliability.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:58:50 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. STENCLIK  moved to slide  24 showing an Alaska  Intertie Flow                                                               
Duration Curve chart  and Load Regions of  Alaskan's Railbelt. He                                                               
reiterated that transmission is a  key enabler for portfolios and                                                               
flows  across  the  network  from the  Fairbanks  region  to  the                                                               
Central  Anchorage  center.  The   central  black  line  shows  a                                                               
supplemental   but   underutilized    transmission.   The   three                                                               
additional scenarios  demonstrate much more flow.  The grid needs                                                               
to  be   larger  to  transfer   more  power,  as  well   as  more                                                               
operationally flexible  to manage load  flows. In this  case, the                                                               
load most  often moves from  the Kenai Peninsula to  the Northern                                                               
load center in Anchorage.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:59:58 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  GIESSEL  confirmed  that   (BAU)  is  the  acronym  for                                                               
"Business as Usual."                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:00:12 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  CLAMAN asked  if the  part of  the model  demonstrates a                                                               
significant increase in  solar and wind capacities,  while not in                                                               
their entirety, may  substitute current Cook Inlet  gas power. He                                                               
asked  if  increased  solar and  wind  capacity  could  partially                                                               
replace the more expensive Cook Inlet Gas as a source of power.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:00:48 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. STENCLIK  concurred and  said that  while natural  gas plants                                                               
remain vital,  wind and solar  can provide energy and  reduce the                                                               
amount of  natural gas  used. Wind and  solar energy  sources are                                                               
considerably cheapest, especially when  utilizing a 40-50 percent                                                               
federal tax credit.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
4:01:20 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  CLAMAN asked  if the  scenario is  dependent on  battery                                                               
technology for capacity storage.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR.  STENCLIK responded  yes, at  a certain  point. The  Railbelt                                                               
system  is a  relatively  small, low-inertia  grid, so  batteries                                                               
would  increase reliability  and help  avoid a  potential rolling                                                               
blackout. Battery  storage is also  helpful to shift  energy from                                                               
one time period to another.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:01:57 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR BISHOP  asked if  the 50 percent  wind and  solar subsidy                                                               
from the  federal government is  attached to  Inflation Reduction                                                               
Act  (IRA) funding  with a  ten-year  cap. He  questioned if  the                                                               
state would require a renewal on the IRA.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:02:33 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. STENCLIK  confirmed that it  is ten-year money.  He explained                                                               
that there is  an Investment Tax Credit (ITC)  and Production Tax                                                               
Credit (PTC), so a plant must  be built before the IRA expires to                                                               
realize federal tax benefits. Even  if the plant operates for 20-                                                               
30 years, it will realize the  benefit in the first year. The PTC                                                               
is a ten-year  benefit based on production, so  the developer can                                                               
choose whether money  is obtained up front on the  capital or the                                                               
ten-year production.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:03:27 PM                                                                                                                    
MATTHEW  RICHWINE,  Founding   Partner,  Telos  Energy,  Saratoga                                                               
Springs,  New  York, provided  an  overview  of the  transmission                                                               
analysis conducted by engineers at Telos Energy.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     What is Analyzed?                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Steady State Analysis                                                                                                    
      Can the grid sustain operations in all credible grid                                                                      
     conditions?                                                                                                                
     • Thermal .notdef look for overloading of lines                                                                            
     • Voltage .notdef ensure enough voltage support                                                                            
     Dynamic Analysis                                                                                                         
       Can the grid recover from the "shock" of a sudden                                                                        
     disturbance?                                                                                                               
     • Frequency Stability                                                                                                      
     • Voltage Stability                                                                                                        
      Transmission analysis is performed on "snapshots" in                                                                      
     time  Stability must be satisfied at every moment                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Richwine said  that engineers  used a  Steady-State analysis                                                               
for several  unforeseen contingency events and  Dynamic analysis,                                                               
which covers the  ability for grid recovery, such  as a lightning                                                               
strike on  the transmission system. These  analyses are performed                                                               
by all Railbelt and global  utilities. The engineers involved are                                                               
specialized. Their  work requires  a unique  skillset that  is in                                                               
high  demand  across  the industry.  The  team  has  successfully                                                               
applied  lessons  obtained  across   the  nation.  Evaluation  of                                                               
reliability is  based on planning  criteria used by  utilities as                                                               
provided in Grid Planning document.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
4:05:41 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE moved  to  slide  29 and  spoke  to the  challenges                                                               
around the Railbelt and the  issues causing further stress on the                                                               
grid.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     What are the Challenges?                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Steady-State                                                                                                             
        • New resources + retirements = different flow                                                                          
          patterns                                                                                                              
        • Different     flow     patterns    .notdef different                                                                  
          needs/locations for voltage support                                                                                   
     Dynamics                                                                                                                 
        • Sudden loss of a power plant .notdef loss of power and                                                                
          voltage support must be quickly recovered                                                                             
        • Sudden loss of a tie line .notdef power and voltage                                                                   
          support must be quickly reallocated                                                                                   
        • Successful recovery is a matter of sufficiency &                                                                      
          timeliness of response from the remaining                                                                             
          resource                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
          This is true for all grids, but the Railbelt is                                                                       
          especially challenged because of the small size,                                                                      
          isolated nature, and grid separation that occurs                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:07:07 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE  moved to slide 30.  He said that engineers  look at                                                               
the  system as  conventional synchronous  machinery, rather  than                                                               
inverter-based or computer code-driven  technologies. Part of the                                                               
big  shift  in  the transition  utilizes  different  technologies                                                               
rooted in software:                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Resource Technologies                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Synchronous Machines (SM) (i.e., Fossil, Nuclear,                                                                        
     Hydro)                                                                                                                     
        • Frequency Response: Inertia (fast/immediate) +                                                                        
          Governor Droop (slower, seconds)                                                                                      
        • Voltage Support: Grid strength (fast/immediate) +                                                                     
          Voltage  Regulation (slower,  seconds) .notdef Behavior                                                               
          dominated  by  physical geometries  Inverter-Based                                                                    
          Resources  (IBR)  (i.e.,   Wind,  Solar,  Battery,                                                                    
          Tidal)                                                                                                                
        • Frequency Response: Droop (slower, seconds)                                                                           
        • Voltage Support: Voltage Regulation (slower, half                                                                     
          a second     seconds) .notdef Behavior dominated by                                                                   
          firmware code                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:08:13 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE spoke to slide 31.  The goal was to determine if the                                                               
grid would survive challenging scenarios based on two criteria:                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1. Time periods with the most resources online                                                                                  
2.  Time  periods  with  a  lot  of  flow  on  Alaska  and  Kenai                                                               
intertides, so intertie loss would cause a shock to the system.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:09:25 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE moved to slide 34.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Potential Mitigation Approaches                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Operational Mitigations                                                                                                  
     • Force more SM to remain online; not recommended for                                                                      
     long-term action; not pursued here                                                                                         
     Capital Investment Mitigations                                                                                           
       • Synchronous Condensers - a connected synchronous                                                                       
     machine that does not produce power or consume fuel                                                                        
        • Inverter Tuning for Performance  adjusting the                                                                        
     configuration of IBR for more aggressive responses                                                                         
       Grid-Forming Inverters (GFM)          an emerging,                                                                       
      commercially available inverter technology that can                                                                       
     stabilize the grid much as synchronous machines do                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Other mitigation  options were considered to  reach stability and                                                               
reliability.   The   simulations    demonstrated   problems   and                                                               
instability with run-of-the-mill technologies.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:11:20 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE   moved  to  slide  35.   Even  amidst  challenging                                                               
conditions  or  mitigations,  grid  forming  inverter  technology                                                               
allows the system to remain  reliable and is applied to resources                                                               
such as  wind and  solar, and battery  energy storage  systems in                                                               
particular.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:12:32 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE moved to slide 36.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Emerging Technology: Grid-Forming Inverters                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     What is it?                                                                                                              
     Grid-forming (GFM) technology is largely a controls                                                                        
     technology                                                                                                                 
     • BESS: no changes to hardware are needed                                                                                  
     • Wind: likely to be controls-only                                                                                         
                                                                                                                              
     What does it do?                                                                                                         
     Attempts to capture the "best of both worlds" from SM                                                                      
     and IBR                                                                                                                    
     • Immediate responses of SM (inertia, grid strength) +                                                                     
     resilience of synchronization from IBR                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
He  said that  the  new technology  is  rooted in  software-based                                                               
technology  intended to  combine  the  strengths of  conventional                                                               
machinery  with converter-based  technology.  The technology  has                                                               
emerged over the past five years.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Richwine moved to slide 37 which listed the following                                                                       
projects:                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     GFM  Industry Experience                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Recent Industry GFM Installations (Utility-Scale)                                                                        
     • 2017 St. Eustatius BESS (SMA)                                                                                            
     • 2018 Dalrymple BESS, Australia (ABB/Hitachi)                                                                             
     • 2018 Kauai BESS projects (Telsa)                                                                                         
     • 2019 Dersalloch Wind, Scottland  (Siemens)                                                                               
     • 2019-2020 IID BESS for Blackstart, California (GE)                                                                       
     • 2022 Wallgrove BESS, Australia (Telsa)                                                                                   
     • 2022 Hornsdale BESS, Australia (Tesla)                                                                                   
     • Others I've likely missed                                                                                                
     More on the Horizon: HECO Stage 2&3, Australia 8 BESS                                                                      
     GFM Projects, NationalGridESO, etc.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:14:08 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR DUNBAR relayed that the municipality of Anchorage had a                                                                 
large software update that was supposed to cost $9 million but                                                                  
catastrophically  ended  up costing  $85  million.  He asked  who                                                               
would be responsible for maintaining the software.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:14:51 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE replied  that the software is part of  the plant and                                                               
inverter-based equipment,  therefore it is the  responsibility of                                                               
the generation owner.  The generation owner submits  a model that                                                               
captures all performance details of  the plant to ensure it meets                                                               
expectations and proves stable on the interconnected system.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:15:34 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  DUNBAR  said that  the  municipality  of Anchorage  used                                                               
Systems,  Applications,  and  Products  (SAP). He  asked  if  the                                                               
entire system would be required  to use the same software company                                                               
or   could  each   unit  generation   use  software   capable  of                                                               
communications   with   the    International   Organization   for                                                               
Standardization (ISO).                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:16:03 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE  explained  that  while  each  plant  has  its  own                                                               
software, they could update and coordinate when set up properly.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:16:33 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  BISHOP compared  the  inverters  proposal to  Artificial                                                               
Intelligence   (AI)  technology   with   regard  to   development                                                               
requirements.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:17:02 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE  said the software  behind this is advanced,  but it                                                               
not  necessarily characterizable  as  AI or  reliant  on AI.  The                                                               
software  was  developed  by  engineering   teams  to  ensure  an                                                               
immediate  and  accurate  equipment  response of  less  than  one                                                               
second.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:17:54 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR GIESSEL said the proposal sounds expensive.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:18:00 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE replied  that relative  to what  is being  produced                                                               
today, the  software upgrade is  a research and  development cost                                                               
that would  be born by  the equipment manufacturers. The  cost to                                                               
implement   the   new   technology,  specifically   for   battery                                                               
resources,  is incremental.  Activating the  technology does  not                                                               
require changes to hardware on large step-changing costs.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:18:40 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  DUNBAR  added  that  he was  scarred  by  the  Anchorage                                                               
software  fiasco.  He continued  with  an  example of  a  similar                                                               
software  upgrade  in  San Diego,  which  experienced  bankruptcy                                                               
following the  faltering of software  updates. He  questioned how                                                               
producers  could protect  themselves  from  fines or  non-working                                                               
technology.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:19:26 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE said  that having a quality  and reputable equipment                                                               
manufacturer  is an  important  factor to  consider. If  software                                                               
problems existed  and were recognized mandating  adjustments, the                                                               
system operator in  Texas, for example, demonstrated  a desire to                                                               
update software through field experiences.  It is not always easy                                                               
to  retroactively update  some types  of equipment.  Much of  the                                                               
current equipment  available provides an opportunity  to magnify,                                                               
mitigate, and resolve potential  risks and challenges in advance.                                                               
He  opined  that  the  issue raised  by  Senator  Dunbar  remains                                                               
important and  is something to keep  on the radar in  the event a                                                               
manufacturer goes out of business, for example.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:22:01 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  GIESSEL   said  that  software  development   is  being                                                               
implemented in other places including Texas.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:22:08 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE  responded yes. The  current inverter  technology is                                                               
widespread and  is the basis  of wind, solar, and  battery energy                                                               
across the  system. Grid-forming  inverter technology  can enable                                                               
renewables connected  to the  system, but is  not subject  to any                                                               
higher risk than conventional software-defined projects.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:22:54 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR BISHOP  proposed a hypothetical  scenario of  100% hydro-                                                               
based operation and  inquired about the need of  inverters on the                                                               
grid.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:23:09 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE replied  that a  100 percent  hydro-based operation                                                               
would not include any inverter-based resources.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:23:31 PM                                                                                                                    
At ease.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:23:47 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR GIESSEL reconvened the meeting.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:24:26 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE  said  the   North  American  Electric  Reliability                                                               
Corporation   (NAERC)  has   actively  assisted   with  providing                                                               
recommendations   to  addressing   risks   and  moving   inverter                                                               
technology to  become more grid  friendly, stable,  and reliable.                                                               
NAERC released a recommendation  in September 2023 promoting grid                                                               
performance technology.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:25:23 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE spoke to slide 38.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     A Note on Analysis Methods & Tools                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
        • Commercially available software (Siemens PSSE)                                                                        
        • Same tools used by Railbelt utilities and                                                                             
          numerous others throughout the world                                                                                  
        • Many thousands of inputs to the model                                                                                 
        • Grid  Lines, transformers, shunts                                                                                     
        • Resources  generators, DER, loads                                                                                     
        • Engineering judgment and special care is needed                                                                       
          with inputs, runs, and interpretation of outputs                                                                      
        • It is critical to know and understand the limits                                                                      
          of the tools, and a what point different tools                                                                        
          are needed                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:25:50 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE moved to slide 39.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Compare installed capacity at each study phase                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
        • Resource Sizing                                                                                                       
             o Initial estimates                                                                                                
        • Generation Analysis                                                                                                   
             o Fossil fuel and battery capacity increased                                                                       
               for capacity reserve margin                                                                                      
        • Transmission Analysis                                                                                                 
             o Battery, shunt capacitor, and synchronous                                                                        
               condensers added for stability                                                                                   
        • Significant increase above initial estimates                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Richwine  said  that  a possible  next  step  could  include                                                               
rewinding and optimizing, as well as adjusting costs and sizing.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:27:20 PM                                                                                                                    
STEVE  COLT, PhD,  Research Professor,  Alaska Center  for Energy                                                               
and  Power  (ACEP),  Fairbanks,   Alaska,  provided  an  economic                                                               
analysis on  required capital  investment. He  spoke to  the base                                                               
capital  expenditure (CAPEX)  after Investment  Tax Credit  (ITC)                                                               
per billion in 2023.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Colt  stated that capital  investment for  development ranges                                                               
from $2.2 billion for the BAU  case to meet doubling of the load,                                                               
while the most  capital-intensive is the hydro  scenario at $9-10                                                               
billion. He noted  that these amounts are  before the application                                                               
of  ITC and  adjusting the  latest AEA  estimates for  inflation.                                                               
After  tax credit  adjustments,  hydro would  cost $6-7  billion.                                                               
Similarly,   nuclear  and   tidal  scenarios   require  a   large                                                               
investment.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Colt said  that ACEP  analyzed  two types  of batteries  and                                                               
other  equipment needed  to  support the  grid.  The orange  bars                                                               
represent an hour-to-hour  generational analysis. The reliability                                                               
team  looked   at  what  it   would  take  to   reach  stability,                                                               
resilience, and reliability. One takeaway  is that the yellow bar                                                               
represents  a   significant  addition   to  the  cost,   but  not                                                               
overwhelming  addition to  cost. Stability  will be  a challenge,                                                               
but not cost-prohibitive.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:31:40 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR BISHOP requested the number  of megawatt (MW) units used                                                               
for dam number for CAPEX.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:32:03 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. COLT replied  that ACEP used 475 MW  of addressable capacity,                                                               
but  understands  that  the  output of  the  project  would  vary                                                               
considering water conditions.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:32:23 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. COLT moved  to slide 42 and spoke to  the consumer generation                                                               
and transmission  cost of service under  different scenarios. The                                                               
image indicates  the location  of this  information on  a utility                                                               
bill. The  generation and transmission  of cost is  equivalent to                                                               
creating  and  getting to  the  distribution  center. It  can  be                                                               
difficult tracing  certain costs. The  rule of thumb is  that $10                                                               
more  per MWh  on the  slide equates  to one  cent per  kWh on  a                                                               
consumer bill.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:34:23 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR CLAMAN asked  about the typical number of kWh  units on a                                                               
consumer's utility bill.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:34:44 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. COLT relayed  that the shortest answer is  about six thousand                                                               
kW  per year,  or  500 per  month for  a  Railbelt household.  An                                                               
additional  six thousand  would be  added if  a consumer  uses an                                                               
electric vehicle (EV).                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:35:59 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. COLT moved to  slide 43 and said that if  Alaska moved from a                                                               
fossil-fuel-based scenario,  it would trade a  significant amount                                                               
of fuel costs for a  roughly equally significant amount of paying                                                               
off capital investment.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
He added the following details regarding the chart on slide 43:                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
The light  beige bar represents  the fixed costs of  wine machine                                                               
operations. It  is a  major component of  a low-carbon,  low fuel                                                               
world.  He said  that  if  the state  made  the daunting  capital                                                               
investment  of  $10  billion,  it  could  potentially  save  $750                                                               
million in fuel  costs every year for the life  of the equipment.                                                               
The state  could save $750 million  in fuel costs every  year for                                                               
as long as the equipment operates.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:37:58 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. COLT  moved to  slide 50  and reminded  the members  that the                                                               
discussion  is in  the perspective  of 2050.  It is  difficult to                                                               
predict how  technology will evolve. He  referenced telephones as                                                               
an example.  With this  perspective in  mind, all  four scenarios                                                               
are  in the  same ballpark.  He  concluded that  after doing  the                                                               
math, evaluating  the equipment, and applying  sensitive cases to                                                               
the basic analysis, the costs are in the same ballpark.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:39:39 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  KAUFMAN conveyed  that  hydrocarbon generates  a lot  of                                                               
revenue for Alaska.  He wondered if the  economic models consider                                                               
revenue  loss and  suggested that  solar and  wind energy  do not                                                               
demonstrate a royalty-based revenue model as does natural gas.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:40:46 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. COLT said that there was  no attempt to unpack the royalty or                                                               
production tax implications of the  reduction in natural gas use.                                                               
He stated  that even  though almost  all of  the natural  gas was                                                               
omitted  from  the  proposed  scenario,  the  focus  was  on  the                                                               
Railbelt grid specifically. There would  still be an abundance of                                                               
natural gas consumed for other uses.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:41:27 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  GIESSEL  added  that   natural  gas  could  potentially                                                               
replace diesel in rural areas.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:41:36 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  KAUFMAN  said   that  there  is  a   broad  spectrum  of                                                               
possibilities. Buying and shipping gas  is costly. He opined that                                                               
Alaska could  enjoy a  successful revenue  model if  it developed                                                               
and  transmitted gas  to  the Railbelt.  In  considering all  the                                                               
risks  of   transitioning  to   different  power   sources,  it's                                                               
important to understand how hydrocarbons  fit in with the current                                                               
revenue model in Alaska.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:42:40 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR BISHOP asked if slide 42  showcased a real bill and if it                                                               
considers the three scenarios on slide 41.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:43:09 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE  responded yes.  It  is  an actual  current  Golden                                                               
Valley electric bill.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:43:17 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR DUNBAR asked about the two additional slides at the end.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:43:51 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  CICILLIO  moved  to  slide  51 and  relayed  that  ACEP  has                                                               
generated a  lot of information  and data,  so she would  like to                                                               
provide  meaning and  highlight key  findings valuable  to Alaska                                                               
stakeholders. Given  the scenario is  27 years in the  future and                                                               
considering uncertainty with  costs, the hope is to  focus on key                                                               
challenges, opportunities,  and lessons  learned for  the future.                                                               
In  any of  the  proposed scenarios,  Railbelt  operates will  be                                                               
significantly  different  than  today.  These  changes  will  not                                                               
happen overnight and will be incremental additions.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
She moved to slide 53.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
[Original punctuation provided.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Focus on the Challenges and Opportunities                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
        • A future low-carbon Railbelt will operate                                                                             
          significantly differently than today or the                                                                           
          Business-as-Usual Scenario.                                                                                           
        • System stability is more difficult to achieve in                                                                      
          low-carbon   scenarios.    Improvements   in   the                                                                    
          inverter  technology of  batteries,  and wind  and                                                                    
          solar   energy  will   be  essential   for  future                                                                    
          Railbelt grid stability.                                                                                              
        • There is great uncertainty in future costs. The                                                                       
          cost  of  service  for  the  low-carbon  scenarios                                                                    
          differs by  -9% to 25% from  the Business-as-Usual                                                                    
          scenario depending on  varying fuel costs, capital                                                                    
          costs, and interest rates.                                                                                            
        • This   study   did    not   evaluate   the   cost-                                                                    
          effectiveness  of  near-term renewable  additions.                                                                    
          The cumulative  cost of  achieving high  levels of                                                                    
          renewable  penetration   is  non-linear,   due  to                                                                    
          increased  transmission and  storage requirements.                                                                    
          From now until at  least 2030, low-carbon projects                                                                    
          will  qualify for  investment tax  credits ranging                                                                    
          from 30-50 percent.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:47:12 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR DUNBAR suggested that legislators  are often pitched with                                                               
carbon capture  and storage ideas.  One idea is for  a coal-fired                                                               
powerplant with carbon capture technology.  He asked if this idea                                                               
has  been analyzed  by  ACEP  and whether  it  could provide  any                                                               
measure of reliability.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:47:58 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. STENCLIK  proposed that the coal-fired  idea is operationally                                                               
analogous to the nuclear scenario. It  is a high capital cost but                                                               
low  fuel cost,  intended  to  run a  very  base  load. It  would                                                               
provide synchronous  generation that could help  mitigate some of                                                               
the grid constraints.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:48:36 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  CICILLIO shared  that there  are other  researchers at  ACEP                                                               
specifically looking  at carbon  capture sequestration  for coal-                                                               
powered plants.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:48:57 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  KAWASAKI said  that while  he  likes the  idea of  using                                                               
electrification  to reduce  carbon emissions,  Fairbanks' concern                                                               
is space  heat. Natural  gas can  be used  for export,  heat, and                                                               
turbines for  electricity. He asked if  consideration went beyond                                                               
the electric grid.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:49:36 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  COLT  appreciated the  question.  He  replied that  Alaska's                                                               
hurdle lays way beyond the  electric grid. ACEP concluded that it                                                               
is too much of a lift to take  on more than the electric grid. He                                                               
hopes the  university, energy industry, and  the policy community                                                               
will embrace  new opportunities. It  is necessary to look  at the                                                               
whole picture.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:50:51 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR GIESSEL  added that ENSTAR  Energy is often left  out of                                                               
the discussion.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:51:00 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR CLAMAN acknowledged  a natural gas shortage  in the short                                                               
term amidst  conversations about long-term  investment decisions.                                                               
He  asked how  state  policymakers could  influence decisions  or                                                               
make  the appropriate  choices to  invest in  solar or  wind, for                                                               
example.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:51:56 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. RICHWINE  said that while  the studies look forward  into the                                                               
future, it does not exclude  the opportunity to look at near-term                                                               
options. A  couple outcomes of  the study include  looking toward                                                               
transmission  reinforcements  or the  ability  for  plants to  be                                                               
interconnected to the grid.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Wind and solar power could  be established in the near-term. From                                                               
a  policy perspective,  having an  RPS or  clean energy  standard                                                               
could provide certainty into the transition and break it down.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:53:11 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR CLAMAN  asked if it  is important for the  legislature to                                                               
address the renewable portfolio standards.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:53:25 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  RICHWINE said  that it  would be  helpful. In  the lower  48                                                               
states,  most projects  are being  financed in  part with  an RPS                                                               
backed  by clean  energy standards.  To  have a  project that  is                                                               
solely  merchant is  rare. Policy-backing  provides certainty  in                                                               
the market and brings development to fruition.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:55:18 PM                                                                                                                    
There being no further business to come before the committee,                                                                   
Co-Chair Giessel adjourned the meeting at 4:55 p.m.                                                                             

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
ACEP Railbelt Decarbonization Fact Sheet 01 19 2024.pdf SRES 1/19/2024 3:30:00 PM
ACEP Railbelt Decarbonization Results PowerPoint 01 19 2024.pdf SRES 1/19/2024 3:30:00 PM